West Indian men do not marry because they are afraid of commitment and the responsibilities. They are a sorry lot.

Like what ?Tell some men so and they run faster than the Jamaican sprinter Bolt. For too long now women has placed themselves in some strange positions where men ,marriage and the family are concerned .Our socialisation of our boys has been and still is filled with flaws and we are contented to go along with a lot of old sayings . Hence the situation now .When a woman can tell you nothing is wrong with a “live wid”.When people still believe in the saying why buy a cow when you can get the milk free ,men and women will always have issues in this area.Men know that if one woman would not ” put out ” another one down the road or up the street will gladly jump at any offer. We have to change our way of thinking .We must stand for something or we will fall for every and anything .

@ Pat I take exception to that comment that West Indian men don’t marry, because they are affaid of commitment and responsibilities. They do get married and I know that for a fact as my husband is West Indian born and breed and had no problem putting a ring on my finger. So I think that the women have to check themselves and want to be a wife not just a “live wid” or baby mother. So don’t blame the West Indian men coz they will only do what they are allowed to get away with!!

Correct me if I am wrong.

People are always complaining about the socialization of men in the Caribbean and that we are afraid of commitment, etc, but aren’t the majority of the men raised by women?

It is sad that most families are single parent, but the women are raising most of the men in our society to be who they are today.

Teach them from young the importance of their contribution to society and stop complaining when they turn out the way in which they were raised.  If we start now, the next generation may see some improvement in their line of thinking.

Just my two cents.

@ valerier richardson I am complete agreement with you.

It is my view that many women are too quick to ‘shack up’ with men. Ladies, if the man claims that he loves you, TELL HIM HE MUST MARRY BEFORE YOU CAN LIVE UNDER THE SAME ROOF.

Many women have the misconception that if they don’t shack up with the guy, then another woman will do so. Well, let her. Because, once a man becomes too comfortable, then HE WILL FIND IT DIFFICULT TO MARRY. In the end, he man will tell you that A GOOD ‘LIVE-HOME’ IS BETTER THAN A BAD MARRIAGE. Eventually, years will go by and you will just be his children mother, or MISTRESS.

LADIES, TIME TO STOP SELLING YOURSELVES CHEAP. LET THESE MEN KNOW WHAT YOU STAND FOR, FROM DAY ONE.Once that is done, then you will have no problem with these guys marrying you.

I speak from experience. My husband is a West Indian, and I put my cards on the table from the start of our relationship. I never allowed him to move in with me until we got marry.

There are numerous factors that can cause men, generally, not to want to get marry. While culture plays a vital role, sometimes the behaviour of some women, can detor men from making that final step in a relationship.

For instance, when a man visits your home, he is doing so to observe your behaviour towards your parents, house-chores, etc. So, if you are disrespectful towards your parents, or do not do house chores, that man will hardly be persuaded to marry you. Yes, he might remain in the relationship, but may never make you his wife.

For example, a man will live with a woman for 5, 10, even 15 years and never pop the question. Yet, when that man encounters another woman, he does not hesitate to do so.  IT SIMPLY MEANS THAT THE PROBLEM IS DEFINITELY NOT THAT WEST INDIAN MEN DO NOT LIKE TO MARRY, but with some women.

This is my opinion. I believe that some men see single mums as being helpless and always on the look out for financial help, and not being in a position to be too selective or fussy.  In such cases the men feel very powerful. What can such women do? The answer is simple do not become a ‘baby carrier’

@Anthony - I see you are following the common tendency of West Indian society to blame the woman for everything.

Let’s get this straight: It is not the job of women to be teaching boys or men ANYTHING. That is the role of their FATHERS. Yes, their ABSENTEE fathers, who if they had been around and done what they were supposed to do, we wouldn’t have the problems with our men that we have today. It doesn’t matter how many women decide to have children. All of these children have fathers and by choosing to absent their roles it is the fault of the fathers (men) not the mothers (women) that the boys did not grow up to be responsible men. A woman can ENABLE a man’s irresponsible behaviour but she is not RESPONSIBLE for it.

@Valeria. You must understand that your husband is the exception not the rule. Your situation is not the reality for most West Indian women. But I agree with you that women must demand better for themselves.

@NIA

I agree with you in that fathers should be present.  However, it’s the role of both parents to teach their children.  Not fathers for boys and mothers for girls.  And the REALITY is, most fathers are not there and the boys are ULTIMATELY raised by the mothers. The issue IMO is that the mothers spew a lot of negativity towards the boys (in some instances) because of the absentee father and that starts the ball rolling in how men treat women after that.

Two more cents.

Your use of the word REALITY and ULTIMATELY is just another way of glossing over the issue at hand and laying the blame with women. Calling it a “reality” is just another way of saying: “Hey, this is life, it’s normal so deal with it!”
It doesn’t matter how much of “a reality” it is – it is still degenerate, abnormal behaviour for men to absent themselves from their parental role. It has only become a “reality” because West Indian society in particular, and black societies in general have decided to normalize and excuse this type of behaviour. No other communities normalize and excuse this in the way that we do. 
So again, this problem will continue until MEN (not women) admit how ABNORMAL their tendency to abandon their children is and act accordingly. If a man exhibits abnormal, degenerate behavior it is not a woman’s responsibility to fix that behavior.

Besides, women will not spew hatred towards their sons if the fathers are playing a present and responsible role.
I’m not justifying women spewing hatred towards their children, I am simply noting that this is an unfortunate and inevitable consequence of irresponsible adult male and female behaviour. 
No. The ball starts rolling the minute the father absents himself from his rightful responsibility.
And just say we were to follow your argument anyway – the boys would grow up hating and ill-treating other MEN not women. Because the mothers are spewing hatred towards MEN (calling the fathers no-good, etc.) That’s what the boys would internalize. Just as girls internalize hatred of themselves because of all the negative images and stereotypes about women that they encounter in our society.

And I take your point about co-parenting, but ultimately boys will listen more to other boys and men, than they do to women.
And in any society there will always be cases where you have single mothers. But even then, when a father is absent, the other men in the community will police boys’ behaviour, and will set boundaries as to what is and is not acceptable. The only place where men don’t do this is in West Indian communities and black communities. Because we unreasonably expect black women to be the work-horse and moral standard bearer for the entire community.

Oh, and your use of the words REALITY and ULTIMATELY are just another way of glossing over the issue at hand and laying the blame with women.  Calling it a “reality” is just another way of saying: “Hey, this is life, it’s normal so deal with it!”

It’s NOT normal for men to abandon their children.

It doesn’t matter how much of “a reality” it is - it is still degenerate, abnormal behaviour for men to absent themselves from their parental role. It has only become a “reality” because West Indian society in particular, and black societies in general have decided to normalize and excuse this type of behaviour. No other communities normalize and excuse this in the way that we do. 
So again, this problem exists because MEN (not women) refuse to admit how ABNORMAL their tendency to abandon their children is and to act accordingly. If a man exhibits abnormal, degenerate behavior it is not a woman’s responsibility to fix that behavior.